Conversations with Public Health Social Work Professionals - Nicole Robinson, MSW, MPH

Nicole Robinson, MSW, MPH

Doctoral Student, University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee Helen Bader School of Social Welfare

Ms. Robinson received a Masters in Social Work and a Masters in Public Health from the University of Michigan, Ann Arbor in 2005.  Ms. Robinson has over 10 years’ professional experience working in the nonprofit sector, mainly as a program evaluator and nonprofit technical assistance provider.  Her past experience includes national evaluations of advocacy and social policy initiatives, evaluation capacity building, and evaluation of foundation grant-making activities.

Ms. Robinson is currently in her second year as a social work doctoral student at the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee Helen Bader School of Social Welfare.  Her research interests include social justice, community-level and place-based interventions, effects of criminal justice policies on communities of color, community engagement and organizing, program evaluation, and multiculturalism in nonprofit management.

What drew you to pursuing a dual MSW MPH?
I initially applied to the School of Social Work (SSW) and once I got in, I then applied to the School of Public Health (SPH).  A colleague of mine was interested in health administration, and the work that she planned to do excited me so I thought, “why not do both?”  Up to that point I had focused quite a bit on health issues (e.g., health promotion, HIV/AIDS prevention, depression, global health), and it made sense to receive a formal public health education and combine it with social work.  In social work, I focused on evaluation and community organizing.  There ended up being quite a bit of overlap between the two schools since several professors at the SPH also used community organizing intervention strategies.  I say "overlap," but really it made my program more cohesive and solid.

My program at UM was a dual degree program and I worked on both degrees simultaneously.

What are the strengths of having both degrees (as you see it)?
Job opportunities.  Plain and simple.  Most job announcements will say "social work, public health or related field," but the hiring organization usually has a favorite degree.  I also think that having both degrees allows you to access both the social welfare/social service system and the health/healthcare system.  Having access to two very large systems allows you access to many more job prospects.

Having been in the field for a while, I also like that I'm familiar with many more theories, frameworks, constructs, and paradigms than my colleagues.  I think I'm able to offer more to my team because I'm well versed in multiple perspectives and can draw on either discipline as needed.  I also did two field placements or internships and that made me more marketable.  My social work placement allowed me to focus on reproductive health policy (see the overlap!) and my public health placement allowed me to focus on my research skills.

I was also strategic with each degree.  I wanted to gain a set of skills and expertise in specific content areas and each school was different in what it could offer me.  Think of it this way, you have that many more courses to choose from to really create a graduate program that is tailored to you and stretches you!

How do the dual degrees complement each other, or how do you, as a professional, integrate the two professional perspectives?

Both degrees are complementary, but you have to do the work to make it that way.  Again, I really tried to be strategic in my course selection and academic activities.  Before I started the first semester, I looked at the jobs that I wanted after graduation and I picked courses that would teach me the skills I needed for that dream job.  I also had access to different research projects and benefited from those connections at each school.  That said, I had plenty of SPH friends that worked on SSW projects and vice versa so you still have to be aggressive and put yourself out there.  Be strategic in what courses you take so that you finish your program well-rounded and with exposure to a lot of different content and skill areas.

On a personal note, I did find that there were major differences in the teaching philosophies and teaching approach used at the different schools and there were differences in the student body and overall "feel" of each school.  All I can say is being able to navigate both worlds will prepare you for the real world where multiple disciplines, personalities, and generations regularly collide.  Don't be overwhelmed by the differences, just go with the flow and switch classes/instructors if it becomes a problem.

What did you do with your dual degree - what professional positions did you hold - did they require a dual degree?  How did you use both sets of skills in your position? 

After graduate school, I ended up in the field of evaluation.  I evaluated many public health and social work programs serving many different kinds of populations.  I - and my employers - really relied on my experience in both sectors to get the job done.  I would say that I relied on public health to teach me about program development, evaluation, and theory and I relied on social work to teach me about community organizing and social systems.  Both taught me a great deal about social justice, oppression, community development, and policy analysis.

None of the positions I've held since graduate school required a dual degree but many people take note of it.  It is still unusual to have more than one Master's degree, so having both a MPH and a MSW still stands out and these two degrees are marked by very different skills and abilities and that also stands out.

What are you doing now, and what's your motivation for pursuing this?
I am working on my PhD in a School of Social Welfare.  What can I say, social work is my first love - funny enough, I have several social work professors who do public health research and assign public heath readings!

Would you recommend that students consider a dual degree? Why or why not?
Yes, definitely!  It won't be a waste of time - it will pay off!  Hopefully it only adds one or two semesters.  And to keep the costs down, take a heavy load if you can.  I did that and while I would never want to do that again, it did keep the tuition loans down.

What do you think the job outlook is for dual degree students in the future?
I think you will be more marketable and your resume will stand out.  At the time I went to school, there were only six of us.  I feel I've had more opportunities with both degrees and I think you'll find that you too will gain access to jobs that aren't necessarily open to the other fields.  In today's job market, that is a plus.

Any other advice or suggestions for students considering or currently pursuing an MSW MPH degree?

Work with your advisor early on to get your degree requirements finalized.  I know it will be difficult because the course schedule won't be available for year 2 or even year 3 and you might not know what you want to focus on yet, but do it.  Make sure that both schools are not counting credits twice (unless that's okay), and that each school is applying your credits appropriately (that is, to the right school and the right degree requirement).  Do multiple checks each semester and each year and work with them closely when it is time to graduate.

If you have a BSW, take advanced-standing in MSW and finish in one year.  That will free you up credit-wise and allow you take classes that fit your needs rather than take required classes that might not fit your academic goals or go towards your MPH.  It was a hard decision for me to make that choice and in some ways I feel a little cheated out of my MSW courses, but it allowed me to finish in 2.5 years and just one summer semester behind my MPH cohort.